Is Downloading TV Progs Wrong?

[DG]

We all know that technically downloading movies may be wrong but what about TV programmes?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4276255.stm

I mean if it's going to be on normal TV in 5 months time, is it wrong to download something because you just want to see what you'd otherwise see anyway but sooner?

[Spliffie]

We all know that technically downloading movies may be wrong but what about TV programmes?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4276255.stm

I mean if it's going to be on normal TV in 5 months time, is it wrong to download something because you just want to see what you'd otherwise see anyway but sooner?

Yeah, it's Crime of the Century :rolleyes: .

[Maladjusted]

Me downloading it won't make a blind bit fo difference, as i don't contribute to viewing figures cos i don't have one of those boxs, can't rememebr what they're called in this country.

[Makoto]

No different from recording the show on VHS apart from recording on VHS don't cause as much fuss. Go figure :rolleyes: .

[DG]

No different from recording the show on VHS apart from recording on VHS don't cause as much fuss. Go figure :rolleyes: .

Well I think the TV companies are saying that it's a problem cos they'll get less money from TV Adverts as less people will watch on TV what they already downloaded off the net 5 months earlier

Like for instance the Sitcom Joey just came out on Channel 5 but you can download like the first 12 episodes off the net

[morrocan roll]

a big fat ...no!
i pay good money for the technology to do such things.
you can't sell me this machine in good faith and then tell me it's fucking illegal to use it ...fuck off ...
can't smoke can't shoot can't hunt can't smoke this either ...can't fish ...or chase rabbits ...drive through this town without paying all over again ...
do ya think i'm going under?

[Jim V]

surely a bigger moral issue is why crap like recent episodes of the simpsons is more popular than the superb Lost

[Jim V]

and on the more general points - legal peer to peer sites with the adverts intact, come on how hard would that be?

[morrocan roll]

He who cannot be trusted in small matters cannot be trusted in large. (sumpfink like that anyway)
something very much like that indeed.
there is no way you can be trusted with the big things in life if you can't be trusted with the little ones ...not sure what it has to do with this thread though.

[Senor Miguel]

Like for instance the Sitcom Joey just came out on Channel 5 but you can download like the first 12 episodes off the net

maybe us students have too much time on our hands but having seen all 15 so far i can't really recommend this to anyone, been waiting for it to pick up but this is 1st class american exported shite.......o.c. series 2 and 24 series 4 are proper bo tho.......... :thumb:

and like f.c.u.k should we pay, the very reason that people have been driven to this is because of the ridiculous retail prices set by greedy companies supposedly based on our 'disposable income'.........well thanks to weed being illegal ergo more pricey, i have more expensive things to pay for..........same for music albums, they can go shove it........they are pretty dumb for not offering legal alternative on the net tho (still in infant stage really), cos how many ppl are gonna get off their arse to go down the shop when everyone has broadband these days, it's a mouseclick away.........they are literally encouraging piracy.

[ShyBoy]

they are pretty dumb for not offering legal alternative on the net tho (still in infant stage really), cos how many ppl are gonna get off their arse to go down the shop when everyone has broadband these days, it's a mouseclick away.........they are literally encouraging piracy.

Hate to contradict you there, but: http://www.apple.com/itunes/store/

they've sold shedloads of songs online, only £1 or £2 per song which is practically nothing, still lots more are transferred over p2p but at the prices you can buy them for now it's because people just want to save their money - nothing really wrong with that.

[Senor Miguel]

Hate to contradict you there, but: http://www.apple.com/itunes/store/

yes mate i'm aware of itunes, but its a fairly recent thing isn't it? they've been slow to sort it out since p2p became a problem for them, c'mon napster was around years before itunes, so it's relatively infant.......now everyone is used to d/ling for free it's a bit late to coax them back.....i was also referring to a comprehensive legal alternative for movies, tv shows, etc.......which doesn't exist afaik, it's their fault for not keeping up with technology......

[ShyBoy]

yes mate i'm aware of itunes, but its a fairly recent thing isn't it? they've been slow to sort it out since p2p became a problem for them, c'mon napster was around years before itunes, so it's relatively infant.......now everyone is used to d/ling for free it's a bit late to coax them back.....i was also referring to a comprehensive legal alternative for movies, tv shows, etc.......which doesn't exist afaik, it's their fault for not keeping up with technology......

I agree completely. I mean, I am incredibly surprised people haven't jumped on the internet media distribution franchise (is it a franchise?) by the bucketload. Millions of people download regularly, if you had a subscription service, built into the ISP for example, where people could download premium TV shows without adverts (I.e. an extra £5 - £10 a month for unlimited progs) then they'd make tonnes. Of course, there will always be people who sit at home with 10 HDD on seperate file servers in their house and download absolutely everything over the net. But, if the average person either had to set up bittorent and download program by program not sure of the quality and not sure of the download speed or from a reliable web service with reviews, guides and easy to browse service, for not that much, a huge portion are going to use it.

[Spliffie]

He who cannot be trusted in small matters cannot be trusted in large. (sumpfink like that anyway)

He who is asking whether it is "wrong" to download TV programmes a few months before they appear on TV needs to sit down and chill the fuck out...and get downloading while he's at it.

Seriously though, I don't get at all why someone would have a hang-up over downloading a tv programme before it comes on the box...

As a very wise and very drunken musician of considerable fame told me on Friday night...

There's shit that matters and shit that doesn't...

And this deffo falls into the latter.

[rhianna_uk]

arite ppl shurup wer can ya download tv programmes from like ad do tha if it woz rli bad like they wldnt hav them on the net so ya can download them i say do it anyway lmao anywayz sum1 reply plz wit a link wer ya can download tv programmes :rolleyes:

[wheresmyplacebo]

Hate to contradict you there, but: http://www.apple.com/itunes/store/

they've sold shedloads of songs online, only £1 or £2 per song which is practically nothing, still lots more are transferred over p2p but at the prices you can buy them for now it's because people just want to save their money - nothing really wrong with that.


how comes we pay more in england though were downloadinf off exactly the same servers as those in frace etc then


and £1 a song isnt cheap considering i get albums of more than 10 songs normally i dont get pop albums with almost all filler, thus me buying a cd for £9 off cdwow is cheaper but wait they got done cause theyre selling cds made in asia to here skipping the cartel that is shops rounds here, and so got done for breaking copyriht law


why id never pay for a download

[ShyBoy]

arite ppl shurup wer can ya download tv programmes from like ad do tha if it woz rli bad like they wldnt hav them on the net so ya can download them i say do it anyway lmao anywayz sum1 reply plz wit a link wer ya can download tv programmes :rolleyes:

Alright people shut up where can you download TV programmes from like I would do if it was really bad like they wouldn't have them on the net so you can download them. I say it do it anyway lmao. Anyway someone reply please with a link where you can download TV programmes :rolleyes:

I think that's what you meant? Giving out links wouldn't please the moderators too much, but do a google search for bittorrent, it's a program a bit like kazaa except cut down loads and you can download files with it. That's the way which most of these programmes are distributed.

And just a word of warning - people on here aren't usually all that sympathetic with posters who don't take the time to write their posts in a legible readable entry, and you could expect your post to either be ignored or you (more likely) would receive abuse from annoyed posters.

[ShyBoy]

how comes we pay more in england though were downloadinf off exactly the same servers as those in frace etc then


and £1 a song isnt cheap considering i get albums of more than 10 songs normally i dont get pop albums with almost all filler, thus me buying a cd for £9 off cdwow is cheaper but wait they got done cause theyre selling cds made in asia to here skipping the cartel that is shops rounds here, and so got done for breaking copyriht law


why id never pay for a download

iTunes looks like they're not in everybody's best books either http://news.com.com/For+iTunes,+it+pays+to+be+French/2100-1027_3-5367762.html

[wheresmyplacebo]

iTunes looks like they're not in everybody's best books either http://news.com.com/For+iTunes,+it+pays+to+be+French/2100-1027_3-5367762.html


i like how they blame market prices, market prices here for cds have been extoriotante for ages which is why we in uk turnt to downloading songs illegally since it was effectively a cartel and still is

[Scarlet]

There's shit that matters and shit that doesn't...

And this deffo falls into the latter.
As the number of people that download programmes/music/films for free increases, the amount of them made will decrease because there will be no financial incentives for people to produce them.

So surely this does matter?

[ShyBoy]

i like how they blame market prices, market prices here for cds have been extoriotante for ages which is why we in uk turnt to downloading songs illegally since it was effectively a cartel and still is

If enough people stopped paying for CDs (as people are) then they will reduce the prices :) it's straightforward economics. Drop the demand, then if you keep the same price you get an excess supply which causes a downward pressure on price.

What they are doing is copying each other - it's illegal for companies to confer and set prices at agreed prices because it destroys competition and is very bad for the consumer and society as well. But the market leader will normally set one price and all the other companies will copy that price - it bypasses the illegality of price setting but still means they can effectively set a high unfair price. If there was true competition you'd get price wars all the time, but then again this fails because people have such a desire for 'their' band, they will pay through the nose to hear them.

If other people recorded the same band and sold their song for a cheaper rate, competition would ensue, and people would get good deals for their CDs. But with the way that the music industry works, you sign an exclusive contract for a fixed amount of time or albums so they effectively have a monopoly on your music.

Monopolies are awful situations, and often the government splits them up and divides it into contracts (i.e. the railway) but it's hard to do that with music. Your best bet is to actually stop buying CDs and encourage all your mates to do the same. It's not actually illegal to make your own recordings, although I'm sure with all their hundreds of lawyers they'll convice you it is. Nobody owns sound, they might own a copy of sound, but they don't own the sound. If they say they do, it's quite frankly unnatural and should be rectified.

[wheresmyplacebo]

If enough people stopped paying for CDs (as people are) then they will reduce the prices :) it's straightforward economics. Drop the demand, then if you keep the same price you get an excess supply which causes a downward pressure on price.

What they are doing is copying each other - it's illegal for companies to confer and set prices at agreed prices because it destroys competition and is very bad for the consumer and society as well. But the market leader will normally set one price and all the other companies will copy that price - it bypasses the illegality of price setting but still means they can effectively set a high unfair price. If there was true competition you'd get price wars all the time, but then again this fails because people have such a desire for 'their' band, they will pay through the nose to hear them.

If other people recorded the same band and sold their song for a cheaper rate, competition would ensue, and people would get good deals for their CDs. But with the way that the music industry works, you sign an exclusive contract for a fixed amount of time or albums so they effectively have a monopoly on your music.

Monopolies are awful situations, and often the government splits them up and divides it into contracts (i.e. the railway) but it's hard to do that with music. Your best bet is to actually stop buying CDs and encourage all your mates to do the same. It's not actually illegal to make your own recordings, although I'm sure with all their hundreds of lawyers they'll convice you it is. Nobody owns sound, they might own a copy of sound, but they don't own the sound. If they say they do, it's quite frankly unnatural and should be rectified.


and all that it summed up by why i dont buy cds, they moan about downloading when the only sales falling are cd singles, cd albums are increasing in selling, mainly due to internet shopping so i can get my cds at a far more reasonable price, say about £8/9 at max, and thats for a physical form of the album i can do stuff with, like change formats, make backups of, have something physical to say "thats mine" and the inserts

and im sure many people will agree

and your economics is getting quite good by the way! :thumb:

personally i try to keep it as legal as poss i do download illegally but thats on a, if its good ill buy it basis, and if its on a "id borrow cd off my mate and maybe copy it and sometimes listen" then ill keep it, but thats not many songs say about 1% at most of total songs i have

[wheresmyplacebo]

As the number of people that download programmes/music/films for free increases, the amount of them made will decrease because there will be no financial incentives for people to produce them.

So surely this does matter?


wel if youre running an 'effective' cartel (to keep shyboy happy) then its the only way to affect things

[Scarlet]

wel if youre running an 'effective' cartel (to keep shyboy happy) then its the only way to affect things
I can appreciate that point of view.

Thing is, a lot of people don't download for that reason. And they don't realise the consequences.

[wheresmyplacebo]

I can appreciate that point of view.

Thing is, a lot of people don't download for that reason. And they don't realise the consequences.


noone i know downloads, just cause theyre complete cheapskates, well i know one person, but he uses private ftp sites and whatnot so cant stop people like that

everyone else i know, downloads odd songs here and there, which are worthless songs really, as well if there was no internet, the person wouldnt get them anyway, thus charging for them will mean noone gets them

and i download odd songs off albums, if i get more than say a quarter of the album i normally buy it

thus my cd collection is now bigger than it would of ever been without internet so they cant complain

but back to topic

for tv shows though, hmmm im not too sure it is technically like taping a show and showing your friends, itd be good if they put them on internet themselves with the advert breaks in etc if they worry so much, and do it such that u cant skip them

[Senor Miguel]

And they don't realise the consequences.

good heavens oh no the labels are gonna lose a few stinking bucks and maybe realise they can't boss the consumer around, that'd be a crying shame......they still make millions so they're not gonna stop or cut down producing anytime soon, thats bollocks imo........organisations like the RIIA will keep trying to scare people by making occasional arrests, but it's like any illegal cartel, a drop in the pond won't make any difference.........all this shit comes down to greed, pure and simple.

[ShyBoy]

all this shit comes down to greed, pure and simple.

But at the end of the day, the prices would never have been that high unless a lot of people weren't willing to pay it. Now you can get them off the internet, things will change whether the record companies like it or not, they're just trying to cling onto the high revenues they currently enjoy.

[morrocan roll]

just think ...this probably means the days of the supergroup are deffinately over ...no more will some squeeky fucking voiced banjo player with a daft name like prod or prick or sting ...be able to lord it over us as the voice of the rainforrest ...while they line their fourteen homes with south american mohogany.
musicians will have to start fucking playing live and local again ...destroy the fucking recording industry ...it destroyed local theatres of music and dance without a bye or leave ...bring 'em down ...we in the long run will benefit enormously.

[ShyBoy]

just think ...this probably means the days of the supergroup are deffinately over ...no more will some squeeky fucking voiced banjo player with a daft name like prod or prick or sting ...be able to lord it over us as the voice of the rainforrest ...while they line their fourteen homes with south american mohogany.
musicians will have to start fucking playing live and local again ...destroy the fucking recording industry ...it destroyed local theatres of music and dance without a bye or leave ...bring 'em down ...we in the long run will benefit enormously.

:yes: definately. I mean, if it was up to me, we'd bring back people buying their dinner with a song and a story :p but everyone wants superfame these days... It's nothing to do with the music, either, it's fashion!

[morrocan roll]

:yes: definately. I mean, if it was up to me, we'd bring back people buying their dinner with a song and a story :p but everyone wants superfame these days... It's nothing to do with the music, either, it's fashion!
superfame is fleeting these days though ...if you look back to the big 60's musicians ...beatles stones floyd dylan etc etc ...they are still selling the same music nearly forty years later ...very few of todays artists will be able to do that.
this is not an argument about talent ...it is an industrialisation of music production that has held sway for thirty years now ...but no longer.
if the entire music industry collapsed next week guess what ...loads of talented bands etc ...would be looking for local bookings ...like it used to be.
those who own the right buildings or can afford to build them ...will make money ...the artists will make money ...some quite a lot but guess what ...the'yll have to fucking work and enjoy it all.
we the public will benefit 100% if downloading breaks the backs of these oil barron mentalities who rule what you get and how much you get it for.
download for free!
bring the bastards to their knees.

[Isenheart8]

Download for free , its good to hit the celebritys pockets, i have over 500+ songs that i downloaded free, if i paid £2 each for them thats 1000 quid!

[Isenheart8]

Mu hahahahahaha,

I set up my own MIRC, server distributing movies which havnt even been released in the cinemas in america yet, within weeks i had letters from the american RIAA threatening me, and my ISP theatened to cut me off,
so all i did was make my server private so that its illiegal for them to connect to it, but everyone else still has access!!
I havnt heard from them since, if you want free movies go on MIRC, on undernet you can join channels like #moviestogo or #freemovies

[Senor Miguel]

aye i've got just over 11000/60gb, so that's a small fortune............RIAA are wankers but you're not actually allowed to advertise illegalities on these boards mate.......shame tho, i would say DC++ is the best p2p around these days, mirc is too tricky for noobs.