I didn't believe this when I heard it.... [Archive]

Turtle

25-03-2001, 09:45 AM

Originally posted by Whowhere:
Now you can see the wool that has been pulled over our eyes by the capitalists and the corporations.
Governments may control our lives but buisnesses control the government.
The government wants to pay us more, but it does so at the risk of losing buisness.
It is a losing battle.

You're not a young communist by any chance, are you? And don't take that badly - i think communism is an extremely good theoretical concept.

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And all the grown-ups say is sorry, cos we got no reply.

Drifter

25-03-2001, 01:28 PM

Originally posted by Turtle:

i think communism is an extremely good theoretical concept.

but not in practise eh?

well it sounds like good ol' karl marx was right doesn't it? rich ppl have all the money and make slaves of the poor.

Apparently 1 in 5 people live in absolute poverty, mainly in urban areas. <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/frown.gif">

Our country sucks willy

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There's a girl in my mirror
I wonder who she is
Sometimes I think I know her
Sometimes I really wish I did

Turtle

25-03-2001, 05:16 PM

Originally posted by Drifter:
but not in practise eh?

arguments for and against. yes, it seems to work in the short run and benefit the working class. but in the long run, a centrally planned economy will not work as effectively as a free market. looking at an economic viewpoint, the four factors of production are not properly employed: although full employment occurs, there is no incentive for people to work harder. if all people are equal, why try and be better?

land and capital are not 100% efficient, nor is enterprise because, again, there is no incentive to be the best in your field, so you don't get leaders like you do in a competitive free market.

socially, again communism benefits the poor and not the upper class and bourgoise. and because, in most countries, the upper class and bourgoise control the state, communism will never be able to sow it's roots again. oh well. good thing that, actually.

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And all the grown-ups say is sorry, cos we got no reply.

~*LIBERTY*~

25-03-2001, 05:41 PM

I think it'd be nice to see at least adifference in the poverty gap.
Some footballers earn more in a week than most ppl earn in a year <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/frown.gif">

I'm not a communist, but I think that it's criminal how you can get paid so much 4 kicking a piece of dead cow skin around.

Whowhere

25-03-2001, 08:14 PM

I believe in Communism in theory. But in practice humans are a competeive race, always trying to outdo one another, which (unfortunately) means communism is doomed to fail as there will always be someone who wants to run things.

Before I did my sociology project I thought capitalism was the best thing in the world, but then I realised that even being in what can only be described as the middle class I am being exploited.
I think it is criminal the amount of money some people make whil the rest of us squat about on meagre earnings. im on £2.85 an hour, some people make more than that in a second. I also strongly disagree with the power that the corporations have on our lives. Here are some snippets from my project:Try here: http://www.globalcircle.net/
or here: http://www.vph.manchester.claranet.co.uk/clara.net/h/e/u/heureka/webspace/gaia/global05.htm
or here: http://www.worldbank.org/

and here's a snippet for free:
If we do this ... if we make it impossible for these 5.6 billion people to escape Coca-Cola ... then we are sure of our future success for many years to come. Doing anything else is not an option. -- Coca-Cola Annual Report

Yet on any one day, McDonald's serves less than one half percent of the world's population. No matter how you calculate it, our global market share - which continues to increase - is not large enough, and we won't leave opportunity on the front counter for the opposition. -- McDonald's Annual Report
And did you know, that surprisingly Microsoft isn't even in the top 10 richest corporations. The richest corporation in the world is General Motors. It makes more profit than the annual gross national product of Denmark with an annual turnover of $189 billion.
Denmark's GNP is only $184 billion. If General Motors was a country it would be 25th in terms of wealth.
These 3 things should be enough to turn even an American into a Communist.

Turtle

28-03-2001, 08:43 PM

Originally posted by j9:

I don't think they can be including Belarus in that, even though belarus is in Europe

j9

my point precisely

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And all the grown-ups say is sorry, cos we got no reply.

MacKenZie

02-04-2001, 02:37 PM

Originally posted by Whowhere:
I believe in Communism in theory. But in practice humans are a competeive race, always trying to outdo one another, which (unfortunately) means communism is doomed to fail as there will always be someone who wants to run things.

Aye... Remember Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-four:

Throughout recorded time, and probably since the end of the Neolithic Age, there have been three kinds of people in the world, the High, the Middle and the Low... Even after enormous upheavals and seemingly irrevocable changes, the same pattern has always reasserted itself...
The aims of these three groups are entirely irreconcilable. The aim of the High is to remain where they are. The aim of the Middle is to change places with the High. The aim of the Low, when they have an aim - for it is an abiding characteristic of the Low that they are too much crushed by drudgery to be more than intermittently conscious of of anything outside their daily lives - is to abolish all distinctions and create a society in which all men shall be equal.

Marx saw changes in who held the power but failed to recognize that whoever holds the power is the new High - by definition the Middle and the Low can't be in charge. Most importantly, there can never be a single class, a single Body, since human beings are quite patently born in different circumstances with different faculties.

P.S. Sorry I've been off the boards for a while, guys, but my Uni frowns severely on sites like this...

Turtle

02-04-2001, 05:33 PM

Originally posted by MacKenZie:
Aye... Remember Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-four:

Throughout recorded time, and probably since the end of the Neolithic Age, there have been three kinds of people in the world, the High, the Middle and the Low... Even after enormous upheavals and seemingly irrevocable changes, the same pattern has always reasserted itself...
The aims of these three groups are entirely irreconcilable. The aim of the High is to remain where they are. The aim of the Middle is to change places with the High. The aim of the Low, when they have an aim - for it is an abiding characteristic of the Low that they are too much crushed by drudgery to be more than intermittently conscious of of anything outside their daily lives - is to abolish all distinctions and create a society in which all men shall be equal.

Marx saw changes in who held the power but failed to recognize that whoever holds the power is the new High - by definition the Middle and the Low can't be in charge. Most importantly, there can never be a single class, a single Body, since human beings are quite patently born in different circumstances with different faculties.

P.S. Sorry I've been off the boards for a while, guys, but my Uni frowns severely on sites like this...

u go to uni at warwick do you? the reason i ask is cos i was thinking of going there, but if i have to give up thesite, well...ahem.

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And all the grown-ups say is sorry, cos we got no reply.

Girl-From-Mars

02-04-2001, 05:41 PM

i applied to warwick but i couldnt be bothered going to the interview coz it wasnt one of my top choices, originally ithought nope, not gonna go TOO far from home.. and then there i was wanting to as far north as possible <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

anyway this is irrelevant to the topic!! sorry <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

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It only takes one tree to make a thousand matches, only takes one match to burn a thousand trees

MacKenZie

02-04-2001, 07:10 PM

Well, 'frowns on' might be an overstatement. There are CCTV cameras in the computer rooms, ostensibly to catch anyone downloading porn etc. Although theSite shouldn't fall into that category, I don't trust some bureaucrat to see things the way you or I would. Besides, I'll be off campus next year, so it makes little difference in the end.

Actually, if you're thinking of Warwick, I do recommend it, but only just. The academic quality in some departments (e.g. Maths) rivals Oxbridge. The problem is that the University's admitting more undergrads than it should, so campus accomodation guarantees for finalists are evaporating, and off-campus accomodation is getting a tad hard to find. Other than that, I'd say 8.5/10.

Turtle

02-04-2001, 08:22 PM

Originally posted by MacKenZie:
Well, 'frowns on' might be an overstatement. There are CCTV cameras in the computer rooms, ostensibly to catch anyone downloading porn etc. Although theSite shouldn't fall into that category, I don't trust some bureaucrat to see things the way you or I would. Besides, I'll be off campus next year, so it makes little difference in the end.

Actually, if you're thinking of Warwick, I do recommend it, but only just. The academic quality in some departments (e.g. Maths) rivals Oxbridge. The problem is that the University's admitting more undergrads than it should, so campus accomodation guarantees for finalists are evaporating, and off-campus accomodation is getting a tad hard to find. Other than that, I'd say 8.5/10.

sounds good. i was particularly attracted to the campus itself - the pictures i saw looked pretty good (even allowing for the fact they are the best face of the campus)

could u tell me nething about the history or economics deps?

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And all the grown-ups say is sorry, cos we got no reply.

MacKenZie

04-04-2001, 04:21 PM

Whoa, sorry for the delay there, Turtle. Gimme another couple of days and I'll root around my friends for some Economics / History people - I know a few.

Turtle

04-04-2001, 05:15 PM

Originally posted by MacKenZie:
Whoa, sorry for the delay there, Turtle. Gimme another couple of days and I'll root around my friends for some Economics / History people - I know a few.

would be very much appreciated, tahnks

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And all the grown-ups say is sorry, cos we got no reply.

J@ke

06-04-2001, 05:21 PM

Originally posted by Turtle:
my point precisely

And what about Greece? I seen Greeks selling the contents of their dirty fingernails they were so poor ...

J@ke

06-04-2001, 05:25 PM

I don't wanna start any arguments but I do think that some of our population keep themselves in the poverty trap ... by relying on benefits etc. NO! NOT EVERYONE but SOME (before I get hung, drawn and quartered). I'm all for helping the worthy needy ... but take these people that have 15 kids but don't work themselves? They get child allowance for each, the council knocks 3 homes together for 'em etc etc ... it's not the kids' fault but the parents deserve to be as poor as anythng ...

Whowhere

06-04-2001, 09:27 PM

Originally posted by J@ke:

I don't wanna start any arguments but I do think that some of our population keep themselves in the poverty trap ... by relying on benefits etc. NO! NOT EVERYONE but SOME (before I get hung, drawn and quartered). I'm all for helping the worthy needy ... but take these people that have 15 kids but don't work themselves? They get child allowance for each, the council knocks 3 homes together for 'em etc etc ... it's not the kids' fault but the parents deserve to be as poor as anythng ...

I agree to an extent. I think that people who are UNWILLING to work should have their benefits cut, so they can experience life on the streets and the people who have been scraping an existence on the streets be put in a nice warm house.
Realisitically i think those people should be ,ade to work, they should be given a boring job in a canning factory and made to pay off their benefits.

Turtle

07-04-2001, 12:47 AM

Originally posted by Whowhere:
I agree to an extent. I think that people who are UNWILLING to work should have their benefits cut, so they can experience life on the streets and the people who have been scraping an existence on the streets be put in a nice warm house.
Realisitically i think those people should be ,ade to work, they should be given a boring job in a canning factory and made to pay off their benefits.

It's called the natural rate of unemployment, whowhere. It is also known as voluntary unemployment. People choose not to work at the offered wage, or there are various factors which i can't remember off the top of my head. But basically, the natural rate does not change, as shown by the Philips curve if u want an economic diagram for it. The Long Run Philips curve is a vertical straight line at the natural rate of unemployment.

No matter what the government does, in the long run the natural rate of unemployment will always stay the same. Simple terms: the number of these people living off the dole will not change, no matter what you do. bad luck.

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And all the grown-ups say is sorry, cos we got no reply.

throbbing_python_of_love

12-04-2001, 10:58 AM

Maybe the Americans can do a charity for the UK! Fundraisers and the like! They can send food and clothes!

Turtle

12-04-2001, 12:08 PM

Originally posted by throbbing_python_of_love:
Maybe the Americans can do a charity for the UK! Fundraisers and the like! They can send food and clothes!

oh fuck off, haven't u been banned yet.

oh and you'll notice i haven't died yet, and there's fuck all you can do about it.

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And all the grown-ups say is sorry, cos we got no reply.

*~stellar~*

15-04-2001, 06:07 PM

What's your definition of someone living in poverty in the UK? This is not including the homeless, I mean someone living in a council flat or something. Let's put everything in perspective here. How do "the poor" (that's just a term I'm using, k, no offence!) live? Is there anyone on here who would consider themselves to be part of that group?

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*~stellar~*

Girl-From-Mars

15-04-2001, 06:09 PM

god this topic is making me feel guilty and bringing back horrible memories of the geography coursework im supposed to be doing. its about residential areas in plymouth and using a variety of indicators of deprivation to measure the quality of life.

im sorry though, im so sick of it i dont want to talk about it any more than i have to!! *promptly leaves this thread*

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Burn baby burn!

Powerslave

16-04-2001, 04:24 AM

I don't see the point with this Government.

They spend £600 million + on a fuckin big dome that sits in London for a year, and yet in this day and age there are people that sleep on streets through no fault, and some fault, of their own with not even a mere suggetsion of temporary accomodation or shelter.

They acknowledged the dome was a loss maker, eventually, yet the entire population of the UK knew that from the outset.

BTW Turtle, isn't Switzerland one of the most affluent places in Euroupe, with low pollution and stuff .... i think Uncle Tony and his sidekicks should get their priorites right before the election.

OK .... once i get going i don't stop ... <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/rolleyes.gif">

Girlfriend doesn't complain though <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

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Only the good die young, all the evil seem to live forever.

[This message has been edited by Powerslave (edited 16-04-2001).]

throbbing_python_of_love

16-04-2001, 09:55 PM

I think i will get all the Kids in America to do a charity collection door to door for thr impoverished Britons!!! hahhahaaha

Girl-From-Mars

16-04-2001, 10:04 PM

Originally posted by throbbing_python_of_love:
I think i will get all the Kids in America to do a charity collection door to door for thr impoverished Britons!!! hahhahaaha

yeah so funny. kinda makes you feel glad christopher columbus found america and took all the weirdos like you and your ancestors over with him!!

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Burn baby burn!

throbbing_python_of_love

16-04-2001, 11:41 PM

Girl, you really must be from Mars or maybe just the intellectual lightweight i always believed you to be <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif"> Columbus did not bring settlers to America. The British were those who settled America and if i am a weirdo i guess i will attribute that to my Anglo Saxon heritage <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/tongue.gif"> Perhaps you should read a book!

Girl-From-Mars

17-04-2001, 12:15 AM

okay hows this?

yeah so funny. kinda makes you feel glad christopher columbus found america and then all the weirdos like you and your ancestors followed some time later!! at least theres a fucking great ocean between the inbred puritans and the real british people anyway!!

oh and FYI i have an IQ of 155 believe it or not <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/tongue.gif">

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Burn baby burn!

throbbing_python_of_love

17-04-2001, 01:37 AM

Actually '155' my British ancestors arrived much later than the puritans. My mother was born a British subject and if she had not left when she was 15, I would never have exsisted!! <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/tongue.gif"> <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

throbbing_python_of_love

17-04-2001, 01:43 AM

I love you all though! British Women are the most beautiful on Earth!!!!!!!

[This message has been edited by throbbing_python_of_love (edited 17-04-2001).]

Girl-From-Mars

17-04-2001, 02:34 AM

well i hardly know your family history do i! just take the point and shut up.

i really dont care how beautiful you think we are, i think you're a sick little fuck who puts photos of people he doesnt know, who didnt even give him permission to USE the pic, on his desktop. now if it were a website you'd put it on, id get it taken down.

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Burn baby burn!

Powerslave

17-04-2001, 03:53 AM

Hey Throbbing Knob-end, why don't you just go fuck a donkey or something that can't tell you to fuck off.

If i wanted an arse to talk i'd have farted .... now take the hint and piss off like a good gullible yankee that you are !!

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Only the good die young, All the evil seem to live forever.

throbbing_python_of_love

17-04-2001, 11:06 AM

Powerslave, show some respect to your better! If it wasn't for us Yanks, Hitler would have turned your poncy little isle into a carpark! <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

throbbing_python_of_love

17-04-2001, 11:14 AM

GFM, I can put any pic on the net on my desktop if i so choose! Thats standard procedure! And what i may or may not do with it is my business. And even if it was posted, you could not easily have it pulled! (like you'd find it anyways!) Though i would not do that. So, i will put any pic i like on my desktop. You don't like the idea, that's tough shit! Don't post your pics then!!

Girl-From-Mars

17-04-2001, 11:42 PM

you obviously dont know shit about the second world war, same as i dont know anything about early american history!!! <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/rolleyes.gif"> ... still ill leave someone who can be bothered to explain it to you one day. powerslave, you might oblige??

and actually if you had a pic of me on a website, i could and i have in the past had it taken down. you dont know my methods or my means and you're not going to <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/tongue.gif"> its a little thing known as copyright.

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Burn baby burn!

Powerslave

17-04-2001, 11:56 PM

Well if it wasn't for you Wan ... sorry Yanks <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif"> we would't have half the shite that's on TV.

Also, if it wasn't for us assisting the US Army in the Gulf War and other conflicts then i doubt they'd have made it back home .... so i suggest amend your subjective history and look at the world as a whole.

We can adequately sustain ourself without the USA, and it's about time that you, your fellow labotomised Americans and that trainee president of yours realised that as well, rather than think the world will evaporate if the USA dwindles. <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/rolleyes.gif">

Wake up and get a dose of reality !! <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/eek.gif">

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Only the good die young, All the evil seem to live forever.

LUKA

18-04-2001, 03:44 AM

Originally posted by throbbing_python_of_love:
If it wasn't for us Yanks, Hitler would have turned your poncy little isle into a carpark! <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

I appologise in advance to our respected members of these boards from across the pond (you know who I mean <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">)

Time for a little history:

The British invented Enigma the code breaking computer.

A german pysicsist invented the H-bomb that you so generously dropped on Hiroshima

I would therefore sugest your forces were just makeweights to help boost the numbers in the fight for a free europe, the real work had already been done by the rest of the Allied forces.

Maybe you'd like to think before you put your fingers on your keyboard.

As for pictures I think you will find that the picture of GFM still remains her intelectual property and therefore you must seek permission to use <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

I so love being me <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

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~ If you can see the beauty of whatyou aspire to, it doesn't matter if you achieve it all. Simply to aspire is no mean achievement ~

LUKA

18-04-2001, 03:49 AM

and another thing, mr python, I think you highlight what's wrong with america today, perhaps you should meet Calvin from here, or my penpal from ohio whose books you could take a leaf from.

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~ If you can see the beauty of whatyou aspire to, it doesn't matter if you achieve it all. Simply to aspire is no mean achievement ~

Girl-From-Mars

18-04-2001, 04:37 AM

lol @ luka and j9 and alza, but in a good way <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/smile.gif"> you know what i mean! (i hope..) still not making an awful lot of sense yet..... im sure dearest throbbing python will have some comment to make about that.... oooh if hes still able to make comments after the email i received earlier from a certain miss K....

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Burn baby burn!

Whowhere

18-04-2001, 06:03 PM

I havent been here for a few days but ive noticed this discussion has turned into a UK vs USA debate as well. How nice lol.
Let me say TPL, i dont know how u can expect to come to a british site and expect u can get away with insulting us.
You yanks aren't so great, waddling around in your capitalist paradise, not realising that you are mostly to blame for the world's problems.
Did you all know, that it takes the Yanks the equivalent of SIX nuclear power plants to power all the office equipment they leave on over night because they cant be arsed to switch off their PC's at night.
We maybe poorer in terms of fiscal wealth but we are richer in many other aspects, we at least have a culture that is infinitely more varied than yours. We arent stupid and slow witted, we dont sue at the drop of a hat.
But what makes me most sad is that for some deranged reason the world's governments dont decide to all band together and turn on you. I know if I was in charge I would at least try.
So TPL, to sum it all up, from me and the rest of the site members, you are a big fat fucking waste of space, and this is a hearty FUCK OFF from me and everyone else.

Powerslave

18-04-2001, 10:52 PM

Originally posted by LUKA:

Maybe you'd like to think before you put your fingers on your keyboard.

HEHEHE ... well said LUKA <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/smile.gif">

I thought he talked out of his arse, or ass !!, as well as his keyboard !! <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">

* waits for dumbass reply from throbbing knobend *

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Only the good die young, All the evil seem to live forever.