Guy owes me £1,000, won't give it back

[Goldersgreen]

I leant a guy from uni (not particularly a best mate or anything, just I'm a complete pushover who can't say no) £1,000 at the end of last year, he said he'd pay me back start of this year, was just having temporary cashflow problems. Well you guessed it he's not paid me back. He has now taken a year off uni for personal reasons so I can't see him in person. I can contact him on MSN/email only. I repeatedly tell him to pay me back, sometimes he says not right now he's out of cash still, he'll see what he can do and pay me back as soon as he can, and most emails he just ignores. What on earth can I do to reclaim it if I can't properly get hold of him? I'm now overdrawn and struggling.

[icey]

well....the word retarded kinda springs to mind. suppose you could take him to a small claims court but then i imaginge you would have to prove you actually lent it him and didnt give it as a gift, also if you gave it in cash youre pretty much stuffed.

[diddlybop]

Im not really sure there is anything you can do - apart from keep asking or maybe threaten him with sending the big boys round to extract the money from him

Do you know if he would actually have any money to pay you back?

Also may I ask why he needed it in the first place? a grand is a hell of a lot of money to lend to someone you don't sounds all that good mates with! :eek:

[Replicant]

that was a bit stupid really...

see if you can get his home address from the uni office, and send a letter to his parents telling the politely the situation.

or at least see if you can get a hold of his mobile / home phone number.

[lipsy]

well....the word retarded kinda springs to mind. suppose you could take him to a small claims court but then i imaginge you would have to prove you actually lent it him and didnt give it as a gift, also if you gave it in cash youre pretty much stuffed.

Not is he still has the e-mails/msn history where he has asked for the money back and the other guy has said he will pay back soon!

[Goldersgreen]

Sent it via bank electronic transfer so have proof if needed. Have his mobile number, he doesn't pick up / says he'll pay later etc.

Don't know if he has the money, he's gone off the rails and spends a lot on ecstacy/coke these days.

Yes I deserve to be called "retarded". I am a complete pushover. If anyone asks for a favour, or asks anything, I don't know how to say no. Hence I always end up going to events/parties I don't really want to go to, always end up getting extra work on my desk in the office, etc. :no:

[icey]

Sorry dude, i retract the retardard comment, was only meant in jest..
As for getting the money back, can you enlist the help of any mutual friends who would back you up? Alternatively i'm sure there will be some kind of advising service at your uni, worth checking it out...

[kwakfanatic]

if you were fairly good friends the courts would assume that you gave the money as a gift unless you can show otherwise. you should try and find out the guys home address, and send a letter to him formally asking that he returns the money to you.

if he doesnt respond you would need to consider making a county court claim against him. this would cost you £120, and you could either make a claim online, or you could go to your local county court and submit an N1 form. as you are on a low income you might be exempt from the court fee, and you would apply for exemption on form EX160A, but if you apply online you cant submit this form. if you win youd get the court costs back anyway. how successful youd be, i dont know.

[Mist]

Really even if you went to court and they considered that he should have to pay it back he can only do that if he actually has money. Which it sounds like he doesn't.

[Skive]

I'm quite happy to lend people money that I trust and I'm fine if they're slow at paying me back for whatever reason, just as long as they don't try to hide from me.

To be honest I'd be doing my best to find out where the little cunt lives and making sure he pays it back, by intimation and force if I had to. Maybe not all in one go because often that simply isn't practical but I WOULD get it back - on cash or as posessions up to the value.

If you don't get it back don't be telling everybody what's happened either, else you'll look like a real soft touch and other people will try and take you for a ride.

[Scary Monster]

Another thing that would be worth a shot is getting it back bit by bit, rather than asking for the whole lot in one go.

Do you students union have any advisory or welfare service? Get in touch with them as they may help.

[pill 'ed]

I'm quite happy to lend people money that I trust and I'm fine if they're slow at paying me back for whatever reason, just as long as they don't try to hide from me.

To be honest I'd be doing my best to find out where the little cunt lives and making sure he pays it back, by intimation and force if I had to. Maybe not all in one go because often that simply isn't practical but I WOULD get it back - on cash or as posessions up to the value.

If you don't get it back don't be telling everybody what's happened either, else you'll look like a real soft touch and other people will try and take you for a ride.

:yes: Fucking right mate, I hate people like that.

Make fucking sure you get it back dude, as Lipsy said, you've got msn conversations and emails from him admitting he owes you money, so use them against him. Use EVERYTHING against him and get your money back, that's alot of cash mate.

[Dobbin]

Don't let it drop. If he's at uni (or was), chances are someone will know him and know where he is. A home visit may be in order? When I've needed to get money off clients, I make a trip to their premises and stay there until I'm given my money. People hate you turning up to their home/place of work, which makes personal visits pretty effective. Might be worth taking someone with you as a safety precaution and also as a witness should this guy later try to pretend you were violent towards him.

[ShyBoy]

Go to his parents? Might be an idea...

[Whowhere]

Contact a bailiff company, see if they'll take on the debt. Either that or small claims court. You'll be able to get his address from the university administrators.

But Jesus Christ, what on Earth did he say to get you to give him a grand??!?!

[Goldersgreen]

But Jesus Christ, what on Earth did he say to get you to give him a grand??!?!
Nothing, just said on msn once literally "Mate can I have a grand, got a cashflow problem, will be able to pay you back asap in about a month" and I didn't think twice about it. As said I'm a complete chump/pushover, if people ask stuff of me I do it for them, hence I always end up spending over £100 every time I go out because everyone asks me for drinks etc :no:

[foxysoxy]

Call this guy!

http://creativebits.org/files/rajesh_ranjan.jpg

[katchika]

Nothing, just said on msn once literally "Mate can I have a grand, got a cashflow problem, will be able to pay you back asap in about a month" and I didn't think twice about it. As said I'm a complete chump/pushover, if people ask stuff of me I do it for them, hence I always end up spending over £100 every time I go out because everyone asks me for drinks etc :no:

I can't add much to what others have said regarding the debt. I recommend never lending or borrowing money if you can avoid it.

I suggest next time you go out, avoid buying rounds. I never get into buying rounds, you always end up either out of pocket or drinking much more than you usually would. Just say: "I'm a bit short on cash at the moment, I'll just get my own." I think buying rounds is silly.

[ShyBoy]

Buying rounds is a good way to avoid a queue. But don't do it with 10 people, just two or three. Works fantabulously.

Namaste got hit by a similar problem. I myself do get ripped off, but it's from my own family who beg and I find it really hard to say no. Especially when I have the cash and they get paid on Friday (this will be a Wednesday) and they need to get my mum a birthday present.

That was March, and I'm still £75 down :grump:

[kwakfanatic]

Contact a bailiff company, see if they'll take on the debt.

A bailiff company wouldn't act, because there would be no point. Bailiffs only have rights to enter the property if there is a CCJ in place, and this has been defaulted on. Without a defaulted CCJ all a debt collector can do is come and knock on the door and ask for the money really politely.

Even if he has no money, its worth pursuing a CCJ in the small claims track of the county court. Even if the court only orders him to pay £1 a month he will repay the debt, and if he misses one payment you can send the bailiffs round to enforce the debt. And most people don't have the sense to find out where they stand with bailiffs, so bailiffs do tend to get money. You could also get an Information Order against the debtor, which means he has to tell you where his savings are, and if he doesn't he will be sent to prison.

[katralla]

If it goes to small claims, surely it goes through the magistrates because it's only £1000. which wold mean no CCJ- or have I got something twisted?

[Yerascrote]

Lol what made you give a grand away to a person you don't know too well? Fuck sake that was a stupid thing to do. I'd get a load of boys round to his house and demand it back or else.

[girl with sharp teeth]

No, debt is a civil matter, not a criminal and so is dealt with by the county court system, which acts as more of a mediation service than one that delivers justice and punishment.

[SuzyCreamcheese]

next time someone asks you something completely outrageous like that, what are you going to say??

Have you learnt your lesson?

[farmer_j]

I think a small claims court might be the way to go if everything else fails. If you have tried to ring his mobile then I think there should be phone records showing that you have been trying to contact him. If you have emails that would be good proof also. As someone suggested, contacting his parents might be a really good idea. What's the worst that can happen? Also, it again demonstrates that you have been actively trying to recover the money.

And if your 'friends' are taking advantage of your kindness then I think you should find some new people to hang out with. You can be nice without being a pushover - people will respect that much more. Best of luck.

[I'm With Stupid]

This is how you get your money back (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UFaQ0T1HnE).

Sorry, not feeling very helpful tonight.

[toth8]

I leant a guy from uni (not particularly a best mate or anything, just I'm a complete pushover who can't say no) £1,000 at the end of last year, he said he'd pay me back start of this year, was just having temporary cashflow problems. Well you guessed it he's not paid me back. He has now taken a year off uni for personal reasons so I can't see him in person. I can contact him on MSN/email only. I repeatedly tell him to pay me back, sometimes he says not right now he's out of cash still, he'll see what he can do and pay me back as soon as he can, and most emails he just ignores. What on earth can I do to reclaim it if I can't properly get hold of him? I'm now overdrawn and struggling.

Sue in the civil court or call the police. It's still theft.

[ShyBoy]

I would get in touch with the universities financial support unit and say you lent him £1000 on the grouds he would pay back, but he has now left university and won't get in contact. They may be able to help and even give you contact information. It's a horrible situation to be in and really I can't believe how selfish he's being. I've had cashflow probs but you just wouldn't impose yourself on someone else, I just tend to whinge.

[VinylVicky]

Get someone big mean and scarey to politely ask for it back on your behalf for a fee

[Mr Orange]

Sue in the civil court or call the police. It's still theft.

I'd imagine the police would just tell you to persue the issue by other means, no doubt pointing towards the small claims court.

I don't think you could declare it as theft.

While it's looking obvious to us on here that he's lying he does keep saying "I'll give it you back soon mate" and that was his initial line too, so it'll be hard to prove he is intended to permenantly deprive the OP of it.


Back to OP, its an awful situation you've got yourself in, it may be one of those where you get nothing more than a learning experience back from it unfortunately.

I know a few years ago I leant one of my best mates £3000, but as soon as i asked for it back a couple of months later he gave it me back £1000 a time every other week so there was no issue.

As mates we regularly go to concerts and things and one of us will by a group of tickets and the rest pay back whenever we have it, recently i spent £150 on 5 tickets, gave them my mates and didnt ask for the money till the night, one of my mates hadnt got paid and just explained this, i didnt see him for a few weeks when i did he was the one to bring it up but mentioned he was going on holiday so would i mind waiting till his pay day afterwards so again it's not really an issue because i know exactly where i stand with it and he's being up front and honest with it all.

I suggest you only lend to people you can trust similarly in future, but i guess you've realised that now

[otter]

Sue in the civil court or call the police. It's still theft.

its not theft. where the hell did you get that from?! - she gave him the money.

a small claims court could be the answer but it will cost you more money to pursue it. he is innocent until proven guilty, and if he doesn't have the money to pay back the court would only act as an intermediary perhaps suggesting he pays you £5 a week for example until he pays it all back in full. - pursuing it through the courts does not mean you will get the £1k back in one go even if you win. it could take him years to pay you back. but thats still one option you might consider.
if you've got financial problems now, go and see your students union / finance office who might be able to offer you some help financially if you are really struggling.
you've probably learned your lesson the hard way. don't be such a pushover in future. learn how to say 'fuck off' to people when you want to.

[kwakfanatic]

Sue in the civil court or call the police. It's still theft.

It's not theft as the money was willingly loaned/gifted by the person who had possession of it. The definition of theft is to remove the item from their possession without permission.

The only option, if negotiation doesn't work, is to go after them in the courts.

otter, if you win you get the court fees refunded, the debtor is responsible for payment. The court would allow offer installments if the debtor responded to the claim form, and most people don't. If they don't respond, or even miss just one payment, you can use other enforcement, such as bailiffs. Civil courts also work on the balance of probabilities, which means the burden of proof is much lower. The hard part would be proving it was a loan not a gift.

[ShyBoy]

It's not theft as the money was willingly loaned/gifted by the person who had possession of it. The definition of theft is to remove the item from their possession without permission.

The only option, if negotiation doesn't work, is to go after them in the courts.

otter, if you win you get the court fees refunded, the debtor is responsible for payment. The court would allow offer installments if the debtor responded to the claim form, and most people don't. If they don't respond, or even miss just one payment, you can use other enforcement, such as bailiffs. Civil courts also work on the balance of probabilities, which means the burden of proof is much lower. The hard part would be proving it was a loan not a gift.

In a small claims court you can't claim legal costs back. Also as has been said it acts as an intermediary rather than a guarantee of your money back. So if he says he's broke they can get him to pay 50p for however long.

Maybe say to him 'I really need the money back and if you're not prepared to start paying back I will have to get the courts involved'. May scare him into action.

[otter]

otter, if you win you get the court fees refunded, the debtor is responsible for payment.
i'm pretty sure you can't in circumstances like this.

[Monserrat]

I lent my sister £3200 for a new car and she gave it back as a lump sum within six weeks. It's not bad going, considering that she's on 25k and I'm only on 14k :-)

I lent a uni friend £65 for a night out back in year 2000. It took him 8 months to give it back, but he did give me an extra £5 for the troubles, which was very kind of him.

[Sofie]

Sue in the civil court or call the police. It's still theft.

How? It wasn't as if he went into his house and took the money was it?

[Goldersgreen]

Thanks for all these responses. How are you guys so knowledgeable about this sorta stuff, do we have lots of policemen and lawyers in the making here? :)

I'm going to threaten him if he doesn't pay up I can issue a court order or whatever against him which will destroy his credit rating and he'll never be able to get a mortgage. Obviously I won't bother actually doing this, but might make him jump.

[DG]

Get someone big mean and scarey to politely ask for it back on your behalf for a fee


One thing going to Uni and more over staying in shared uni accommodation is how different people's personal ethics are - credit card company sent around just such a bloke to our flat to find our flat mate that ran off after maxing out his credit card

[otter]

One thing going to Uni and more over staying in shared uni accommodation is how different people's personal ethics are - credit card company sent around just such a bloke to our flat to find our flat mate that ran off after maxing out his credit card

its not so much about personal ethics as being a complete arse-hole. if he thought what he was doing was right (ethical) why did he run off? he knew it was wrong and that's theft.

[kwakfanatic]

i'm pretty sure you can't in circumstances like this.

if you get judgment against a debtor then the debtor is liable for the court fees you incurred in submitting the n1. the circumstances of the judgment are irrelevant- if you get a ccj the debtor has to stump up the court fee as part of the ccj.

In a small claims court you can't claim legal costs back. Also as has been said it acts as an intermediary rather than a guarantee of your money back. So if he says he's broke they can get him to pay 50p for however long.

if you win against a debtor in the county court small claims track, you will get the court fee refunded, and if you took legal advice in making the claim you can usually claim up to about £200 costs as part of the ccj. the court would make the decision on whether to award costs.

a ccj doesnt guarantee that you get the money back, and if the debtor submits all the forms at the right time the court will decide on a repayment plan. the minimum offer would be £1 a month, but the court decides what the debtor can afford, and will order more if the income is there.

a lot of debtors dont submit the forms properly, though, and if they dont you can get judgment in default. this means that the ccj is for the whole amount, and it is payable immediately (ie the court orders one installment for the full amount).

if the debtor misses even just one instalment you can get a warrant of execution from the court, and bailiffs will be sent out to the debtor's address to levy goods. you can also take out other enforcement action, such as getting a charging order against property that the debtor owns.

[toth8]

How? It wasn't as if he went into his house and took the money was it?

It's still theft under the 1968 Theft Act.

If you borrow something from someone and refuse to give it back, it can still be considered theft.

[Mr Orange]

It's still theft under the 1968 Theft Act.

If you borrow something from someone and refuse to give it back, it can still be considered theft.

Theft - Section 1 (1) Theft Act 1968

"Dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention to permenantly depriving the other of it."

He hasn't refused to give it back, no time frame was set for it to be given back by, and the person who has borrowed the money has continued to say he will give it back when he has it available.

Showing that regardless of how it appears to us, the intention to permenantly deprive isn't there.


So no in the OPs case it's not theft.